Comments on: Who makes the rules? Esau is to Jacob as Ben is to Widmore http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/ "Each of us was brought to the island for a reason." -- John Locke Mon, 23 Jan 2012 19:48:57 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Ms Terri http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/comment-page-1/#comment-610 Ms Terri Sun, 24 May 2009 07:20:16 +0000 http://www.forareasonblog.com/?p=1036#comment-610 White shirt/black shirt yin/yang -- I like that! It's a great image. And it fits in so well with Laneerg's idea of the leaders always coming in sets of two! Wow -- we may have really figured something out here! White shirt/black shirt yin/yang — I like that! It’s a great image. And it fits in so well with Laneerg’s idea of the leaders always coming in sets of two! Wow — we may have really figured something out here!

]]> By: Val http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/comment-page-1/#comment-609 Val Sun, 24 May 2009 06:19:33 +0000 http://www.forareasonblog.com/?p=1036#comment-609 I'm thinking something Very Bad happens to a person who upsets the balance and kills the other leader. I'm assuming this double leader is kind of a yin/yang thing, as illustrated by the white shirt/black shirt on our immortal boys in that opening scene? *looks for melon baller for brain scooping* I’m thinking something Very Bad happens to a person who upsets the balance and kills the other leader. I’m assuming this double leader is kind of a yin/yang thing, as illustrated by the white shirt/black shirt on our immortal boys in that opening scene?

*looks for melon baller for brain scooping*

]]> By: Ms Terri http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/comment-page-1/#comment-606 Ms Terri Sun, 24 May 2009 05:27:36 +0000 http://www.forareasonblog.com/?p=1036#comment-606 Hi Val! Yeah, I think that's the loophole too. But why does Esau need a loophole? Why couldn't he just kill Jacob himself whenever he felt like it? <-- Just a few questions to help keep your brain at a pleasantly mushy consistency, in case it was in danger of resolidifying . ;-) Hi Val! Yeah, I think that’s the loophole too.

But why does Esau need a loophole? Why couldn’t he just kill Jacob himself whenever he felt like it? < – Just a few questions to help keep your brain at a pleasantly mushy consistency, in case it was in danger of resolidifying . ;-)

]]> By: Ms Terri http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/comment-page-1/#comment-605 Ms Terri Sun, 24 May 2009 05:23:24 +0000 http://www.forareasonblog.com/?p=1036#comment-605 LOL! Me too. Maybe the leader immunity is only protection from being killed by the co- leader (in the leader set you talked about in your first comment)? So, Widmore couldn't kill Ben, but maybe cancer could? Hah -- we're starting to get enough material here to write a TV show of our own! ;-) LOL! Me too.

Maybe the leader immunity is only protection from being killed by the co- leader (in the leader set you talked about in your first comment)? So, Widmore couldn’t kill Ben, but maybe cancer could?

Hah — we’re starting to get enough material here to write a TV show of our own! ;-)

]]> By: Val http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/comment-page-1/#comment-603 Val Sun, 24 May 2009 05:16:42 +0000 http://www.forareasonblog.com/?p=1036#comment-603 I'm guessing the loophole is that he gets Ben to kill Jacob, rather than doing it himself? Although I think it's a pretty big loophole that he comes back to life as someone else...gah...my head is starting to turn to mush again! :P I’m guessing the loophole is that he gets Ben to kill Jacob, rather than doing it himself? Although I think it’s a pretty big loophole that he comes back to life as someone else…gah…my head is starting to turn to mush again! :P

]]> By: laneerg http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/comment-page-1/#comment-602 laneerg Sun, 24 May 2009 04:46:42 +0000 http://www.forareasonblog.com/?p=1036#comment-602 I wonder, would Ben be descended from Essau then? That is an interesting thought, by Locke knowing about Eloise, he was taken out of the island's protection. But ... Ben knew about Eloise, presumably before he did the wheel turn and lost his leader role. And what about Ben with the cancer in his back? Would he have truly died if Jack hadn't come along? Had he lost his leader status protection already, and just didn't realize it? Ack! Questions begat questions begat questions and still more questions! :) I love Lost. I wonder, would Ben be descended from Essau then?

That is an interesting thought, by Locke knowing about Eloise, he was taken out of the island’s protection. But … Ben knew about Eloise, presumably before he did the wheel turn and lost his leader role. And what about Ben with the cancer in his back? Would he have truly died if Jack hadn’t come along? Had he lost his leader status protection already, and just didn’t realize it?

Ack! Questions begat questions begat questions and still more questions! :) I love Lost.

]]> By: Ms Terri http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/comment-page-1/#comment-601 Ms Terri Sun, 24 May 2009 02:52:58 +0000 http://www.forareasonblog.com/?p=1036#comment-601 That's VERY interesting! It's like a pact being passed down from generation to generation -- a pact of protection extending from parents to their children, and also the special leadership role passing down from one generation of leaders to the next. Your comment just gave me an idea -- think about how on Crazy Island, some of these people never age -- I wonder if Jacob and/or Esau could be an ancestor(s) of Ben and Widmore. So then they would have passed down both the leadership role and the parental protection! Ha. How weird would that be? Then when Ben killed Jacob, he would really have been acting out his (great-great-great-great-grand-) Daddy issues. As for Ben not being able to kill Locke the first time, but killing him on the second try -- that's a brain twister! It could be what you said -- when Ben lost the leadership role, he was no longer bound by the rules for leaders. Also there was something strange in the scene where Ben killed Locke, which as far as I know has never been explained. Remember how Ben talked Locke out of killing himself, but killed him right after Locke mentioned Eloise Hawking. Could Locke's knowing Eloise Hawking somehow cancel out whatever protection he might otherwise have from Ben? That’s VERY interesting! It’s like a pact being passed down from generation to generation — a pact of protection extending from parents to their children, and also the special leadership role passing down from one generation of leaders to the next.

Your comment just gave me an idea — think about how on Crazy Island, some of these people never age — I wonder if Jacob and/or Esau could be an ancestor(s) of Ben and Widmore. So then they would have passed down both the leadership role and the parental protection! Ha. How weird would that be? Then when Ben killed Jacob, he would really have been acting out his (great-great-great-great-grand-) Daddy issues.

As for Ben not being able to kill Locke the first time, but killing him on the second try — that’s a brain twister!

It could be what you said — when Ben lost the leadership role, he was no longer bound by the rules for leaders.

Also there was something strange in the scene where Ben killed Locke, which as far as I know has never been explained. Remember how Ben talked Locke out of killing himself, but killed him right after Locke mentioned Eloise Hawking. Could Locke’s knowing Eloise Hawking somehow cancel out whatever protection he might otherwise have from Ben?

]]> By: laneerg http://www.forareasonblog.com/2009/05/23/who-makes-the-rules-esau-is-to-jacob-as-ben-is-to-widmore/comment-page-1/#comment-600 laneerg Sun, 24 May 2009 02:17:42 +0000 http://www.forareasonblog.com/?p=1036#comment-600 Hmm.. You brought up a great point. Just what could be of greater authority to make the rules? Maybe there were people on the island pre Jacob/Essau who set out some kind of rule that the there were to be two main leaders, a Jacob/Essau, Ben/Widmore etc., and that those two could do no mortal harm to the other, nor to any of their children, but no rules regarding any followers of either leader. Somehow this gets passed down from leader set to leader set. Perhaps this is also why Locke did not die when Ben shot him in the gut - but then that begs the question as to how Locke was able to die via Ben off island. Perhaps Ben was no longer the leader, so he was able to harm Locke? Hmm.. You brought up a great point. Just what could be of greater authority to make the rules? Maybe there were people on the island pre Jacob/Essau who set out some kind of rule that the there were to be two main leaders, a Jacob/Essau, Ben/Widmore etc., and that those two could do no mortal harm to the other, nor to any of their children, but no rules regarding any followers of either leader. Somehow this gets passed down from leader set to leader set.

Perhaps this is also why Locke did not die when Ben shot him in the gut – but then that begs the question as to how Locke was able to die via Ben off island. Perhaps Ben was no longer the leader, so he was able to harm Locke?

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